From Touched to Empowered | Katie Miller

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:00:00

So hello, everybody. It's Deana with The Realized Foundation. And I'm here with Katie Miller today. And Katie is one of our authors in Book Three. And she is also part of the team's suicide prevention society, which we're going to talk about. But first, Katie, I want to ask you, what is your chapter about?

Katie Miller: 00:00:25

The chapter title is called, From Touched to Empowered. And it goes through my story, my perspective of what happened, that left me touched by suicide, and how that connected with my sisters, and my mom, and every everyone else who started the teen suicide prevention society. What I did not realize is that when my sister gave her seven minute talk about her first suicide attempt, and all of the attempts that followed, she's still with us. But she still struggles with suicidal thoughts every day. And she wanted to get the tools that she had learned into the hands of teens before they needed them. And this was in, I believe, it was August of 2019, when my sister gave that talk. So that's what launched the mission itself. But going through the process of working with the teen suicide prevention society, I remembered other times where there were other situations with other friends or family members, where suicide came across, either as an attempt, or they had died. And so that's why I wrote the chapter that I did, because there were all these little touches along the way, and that just led to our family being empowered to do something about it.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:01:53

Thank you for sharing that. It's important, and I can relate to part of what your sister has gone through, obviously, and I don't know the whole story, but it's anybody who's dealing with that. Whether it's teens like you, your mission is teens, and my mission is more adults and business owners and stuff like that. But it all matters and the the statistics for the teens, especially in the last couple years is staggering, credibly sad. So that brings me to ask you why you were a unicorn horn.

Katie Miller: 00:02:34

I refuse to grow up. That's part that's part of the reason. Part of the one of the tools that we use is finding out what is your reason for staying, you know, why not commit suicide. And when we were first building this script, and we were building out these tools, my mom Jackie Simmons was creating the script for the talk that saves lives. And one of the questions is why stay and me being her guinea pig for the very first talk at stripe was being very sarcastic and said, because I haven't seen a unicorn yet dammit. Well, lo and behold, my subconscious heard we say this out loud and thought it was important enough for me to keep it stored in a file called reasons for staying. didn't think anything about it for the next couple of years. Until I almost lost my husband. And things got really dark. For the family for as long for me it got really dark. And part of me was debating whether it would be better for me to stay or better for me to go. So then the life insurance money would be available for my husband and our son. And lo and behold this little voice in the back of my head piped up and said but you haven't seen a unicorn and I was like holy crap. This script worked by my brain remembered that that was one of the reasons that I had given and so that's the other reason why we're the unicorn horn is because it one it makes me smile. It brings me joy in my life. But the other one is that it reminds me that it doesn't matter how dark it is. There's still like there's still an option.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:04:36

That's true that I love that story. I love that story.

Katie Miller: 00:04:43

It was it was one of those that's like, oh, wow, this um, shoot, I have to tell my mom she's right. It worked.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:04:52

Well I'm glad she's right and I'm glad that you guys have this. This tool for kids and and pay I want to have a conversation and nuts. It's so important. It's so crazy how much one conversation can change so much.

Katie Miller: 00:05:13

And, and the script is even though the script was for the teen suicide prevention society, the talk that saves lives could be used for any demographic, any group that's at risk. It's really just changing the one word in the very first question. And the first question is, have you heard about the rise in teen suicide? Well exchange teen for veterans, or veterinarians, or doctors or teachers, or LG? BT Q communities? You know, you so that one question, even though we say don't change the script, that one question can be altered slightly to whichever demographic it is that the person you are talking to fits in, or one that you are passionate about making a positive impact on.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:06:08

I mean, my brain always goes to entrepreneurs. Yes. That's my life. Anything about you know, losing people like Kate Spade and, and Twitch, and it just breaks my heart because they had so much. They had so much to live for, and so much that they gave to the world and and that goes for anybody. But it's just, you know, I think that demographic has different struggles than than teens, obviously, or then other people who have different professions. But it's, um, I don't know, I didn't mean to get off topic, but that's okay. Because, because it's reading about about twitch and how Allison was had to go to court to even get the world he's from stuff they built, because he didn't have a will. And well, the whole life insurance thing is really touchy, too, because some people will not cover it, if it's suicide. So there's, there's a lot of things that that are logistical around, somebody dying, that suicide changes, if that makes sense.

Katie Miller: 00:07:27

It does. And that's why one of the things that I focus on is just breaking the silence around it. Because you will notice I don't use the phrase commit suicide. And the reason is, because commit indicates there's a crime involved. And way back when it was considered a crime against the community, because it's been proven that if you have been touched by suicide, your subconscious tells you that is an option. Well, thanks to social media and the news, we all know, a designer and entrepreneur, a singer and actor, comedian, I mean, there's the list goes on and on as to wow, I, if I don't know them, personally, I at least know of someone. So that puts that increases everybody's risk of suicide. So I understand why from the logical part of my brain, and previously working in insurance, why they would have that in there. But that's kind of changed because it's not a crime, it just means that they did not see there was another option available. Yeah. And that's why I work so much with the teens. Because the prefrontal cortex, the section of the brain right here in the front, about that helps us make a critical decision in our lives isn't even fully developed until we're 25 and weren't expecting teenagers to make adult decisions when they're still dealing with raging hormones, and high emotions. Okay, so that's where my folk, you know, yes, we're all the teen suicide prevention society. But working one on one with teens and young adults is where my focus has been.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:09:25

Yeah, I'm just putting up your website so people can eat

Katie Miller: 00:09:31

teaspoons.org is a redirect to the website because the website is actually teensuicidepreventionsociety.ca. So, we found teaspoons.org Because tsps teen suicide prevention society teaspoons. It's kind of cute.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:09:53

Yeah, it's catchy so it's easier to remember.

Katie Miller: 00:09:57

Well, the other thing is, is all it takes us into You spend a kindness and you can positively impact someone's world, not just their day, their world.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:10:10

That is a good point. So that brings me to another question for you. Sure. And that is, how have you, um, your experience through this project of writing in this book and being part of our community? And what is that? What kind of impact is that left on you?

Katie Miller: 00:10:36

Wow. It's actually interesting because it several different ways, it impacted me. One of them is the fact that in the beginning of my chapter, I refer to an incident that happened when I was a teenager involving one of my friends. And I actually reached out to that friend, and told them that I was going to be sharing the story, and wanted to give them the heads up and offer to let them read the first draft, when I had the chapter written. And I have not spoken to this individual for years, well, over well over five or six years, probably even longer than that. They actually responded to me this time, through social media, and so that they would be interested in at least reading the chapter. And thank you for the heads up. So I did, I sent him the chapter. And I said, if there's anything that needs to change, you know, let me know, I didn't hear anything. So I'm like, okay, that's perfectly fine. I did what I thought was necessary, because I am sharing someone else's story, but from my point of view, and so that helped me connect, at least for a little while with this individual and find out, you know, what, I just want to make sure everything's still okay. The other process of it, that was fascinating was the writing part of it. And I've written chapters for other copulation books before, but they've always been like, short things, like a page, maybe three. So with this one, it was interesting, because I wanted to make sure that I did the story justice. And I was afraid that it was going to take me for ever to write it. When in actuality, all it took was for me to sit down and start typing. And it's interesting because you'll, when you read the chapter, the first word, the first like three sentence talks about how I can hear my mom calling me telling me that I have a phone call. Because that's how I remember, that's the beginning of the story that I'm sharing, was receiving a phone call from my friend. And it just flew. The words just came right out of me right into typing it out. And I was surprised that when I went back and read it, it didn't need editing. It was exactly as I remembered it. Now, granted, my memory might become more clear later on, so more details might be needed. But at this moment, it's exactly what it needed. And all the parts that would give any kind of indication as to who my friend is, was changed to my friend, or they, because I didn't have permission to share that. So it is a little bit distant in the story because of that, but I wanted to honor their identity, because I didn't have permission. So it's still hard to think about what has happened with this friend and with other friends. Because I've had several friends who have tried or died by suicide. And it's heartbreaking because you can't see it coming. There are no outward signs. And when we asked teens who had attempted there, you know why their response was, I don't know. And the only reason it's an I don't know is because they didn't see any other option at that point in time. So one of the things that I do as a coach is I help create personal pause buttons. So then when someone is feeling anxious, stressed, depressed, overwhelmed, They can press a pause button, bring their fingers together like making the okay sign. And it instantly slows the heart rate and causes the mind to clear. And let you see that there are options. One of the things we don't want to do is make a permanent choice to a fixable solution. And having a bad days is easily fixable. That is true. Very true. And sometimes there's a lot more to it than that. But that's why there's always options to work with somebody. And depending on whether it is to the point to where you need truly and you truly need intervention, will you speak to doctors and everything like that, or it is more upstream, where it's pure prevention, what is just sharing that you're having a negative thought that is perfectly normal and human to have a negative.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:16:10

Yesterday, and multiple times a day,

Katie Miller: 00:16:13

and multiple times a day, the problem is getting stuck in that negative echo chamber. Yeah, and that's why we have things like the script to have a conversation with somebody. And we even have a why not workbook, which is a workbook you could do yourself. And it breaks you out of that negative echo chamber. And both of those are for free on our website. You can go to the website right there at the top, there's a button that says Get the guide.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:16:43

And it's really awesome. Everyone, you should do it.

Katie Miller: 00:16:47

Yeah, read it, share it. Don't spread it out to everybody. Yeah, we want to suicide proof the world?

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:16:55

Yes, we do. Yes, we do. And it starts the conversation.

Katie Miller: 00:17:02

And even if it's something as silly as I have a guide, that gave me a script. For me to become an advocate for living, I need to practice Do you mind helping me practice my script? There is no judgment. There. It is all neutral language. And it is available to have an open conversation. And the person that you ask, is probably going to say, Oh, this is practice. They're not judging me not a problem. Oh, I get to help, yay. And I added to the script to the end of my chapter. So I have another way to help get it out into the world.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:17:47

That's awesome. That's great. And even, you know, even though it was made for teens in mind, it might just help a lot of adults once it's in the book and out in the world.

Katie Miller: 00:18:01

Well, let's see, my sister gave her talk in August of 2019. So by the time we went through the process, and received our 501 C three, classification, it was April 1 2020. April falls on us that was right when they were closing the schools due to COVID. So everything that we were planning on doing going into the schools got to be put on hold. And that's when we realized with the attempts rising across the board, that yes, we're the teen suicide prevention society, but we want to stop it for everyone. Absolutely. And that's why we made the adjustment to the script, you know, you can change that first question.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:18:52

Well, I want to share that the realized Foundation was formed on March 30, of 2020. That's and we had been talking about it for about a year prior because in my former business, we did events all over the state of Colorado. And what we were doing was we were trying to create team building stuff for our corporate clients that would be around mental health. And that was the original idea. But then it's it turned into something totally different because God had a different plan. And that's okay. But also your story about your friend is also very dear to my heart because the whole reason I'm doing what I'm doing is because I lost a friend suicide. And it was somebody I had known and worked with for 20 plus years. And I don't have permission to share his name either. But everyone always asked To me who it is, and, you know, people in my circles in Colorado know, but it's not something I could talk about publicly, but it's just, we had been trying to have lunch for months before. And we just never had our, we both traveled a lot, we just never got our schedules to line up, and I didn't get to have that lunch. And that one sentence is what keeps me doing what I'm doing. Because I don't ever want to have that happen again. But yeah, that's why we're here. That's why there is a scars to stars. And I'm excited about the future. Because with two years, and not a lot of money, and not a lot of reach, we've done a lot of things for good. And I know how many people we've helped. So imagine if we can raise the money, and we can have more events and reach more people, what we can do, and especially when we team up with other organizations like yours, like what we can do in the world.

Katie Miller: 00:21:11

Absolutely. So much information is available now. i When, let's see, my sister would have been about 13. So we're talking mid 90s. When she had her attempt, or her first attempt, I should say it was mid to late 90s. For my friend from high school. You know, there was not a lot of information at all during that point in time. In fact, one of the top indicators of that you were potentially suicidal, was actually visiting the Center for Disease Control website and looking up suicide prevention. You there was nothing. There was nothing before that. Everything was always in reaction, there was nothing that was pure prevention. And so that's what we've been working on. And with what you've been doing, you're working on it as well. And there's been so many people who have come forward just talking on a hole about, you know, mental health issues. And how it's not a bad thing. This is normal for us. You know, it's not a stigma, not somebody swept underneath the rug, you know, that is helping as well.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:22:44

Yeah. What my attempt was in 97, it was around the same time. And I was taken to the hospital and woke up there. And was pretty angry that I was alive, to be honest with you. And within eight hours of me being checked into the hospital, they let me walk out the front door with a note to call the doctor and make an appointment. Yes,

Katie Miller: 00:23:20

only eight hours.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:23:22

Yes. It was probably midnight 1am or so. Maybe two when I got there, and I was home by midday the next day.

Katie Miller: 00:23:38

Yeah, I'm not sure how long my sister was there. Because to be honest, I have very little memory of that day. It's funny, it didn't dawn on me as to what they she had her first attempt until sometime this year, actually, after hearing the TED Talk that my mom did, about Stephanie's suicide attempt and about our mission for the teen suicide prevention society that it dawned on me that the memory that I have of being pissed off that my sister got to have a sleepover with my mom in the living room. And I never got to have a sleepover with mom. There's something not right about this was actually the night that my sister had attempted. And it didn't dawn on me until this year. Yeah, because my brain was protecting me.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:24:37

And it's it's funny that perspectives. It's kind of like watching those crime movies where you get all these different people talking about a crime or something that happened and they all have a different picture of what actually happened. And in 2021 I decided I was going to talk about this you And I started trying to journal and remember and finally went to a therapist and talked about it. And during that time, there was the, the day, or the, the few hours around my attempts are so crystal clear to me, it's crazy. Like it was like I just did it all just happened, I can remember it that clear. I remember what I was wearing when I woke up in the hospital. But I can't remember so many other things around it. And so, in 2020, I started reaching out to some of my friends that I hadn't, I've kept in touch with but didn't really see that much anymore, because we don't live in the same place. And ask them to tell me what they remembered around that time. And it was, it was kind of crazy. What some of them remembered or thought because none of them knew the whole story. I've never, I'd never told anybody right, what happened or what, why or anything. And so even my mom, like I was, I was managing a restaurant at the time. And I went to work the next day, the next few days, I came home a couple days later, and my mom was sitting in my living room. And I was in Phoenix. And she lived in Louisiana, who field trip. And neither one of us know how she got in. Neither one of us can remember many things about that couple days that she was there. It's just so crazy to me how our mind works. Like you said, it protects you from certain things, or it, maybe hide things from you that you just it doesn't matter. Because it's it's a detail or a conversation that maybe hurts us and to remember it is to relive the whole thing. I don't know. But it's,

Katie Miller: 00:27:16

that is one thing that can easily happen. One of the things that I found with the training that I've done for creating the personal pause buttons, and the process for dismantling the negative emotional triggers from the events of our past is that our brain is an amazing search engine. And it remembers everything, even though we consciously can't remember everything. And that's why it's so important about what we say, not only about others, but most importantly what we say about ourselves. And it's not just you know, speaking it out loud, which you know, reinforces that because you're tasting your words when you speak and you hear yourself speak. But even just talking to yourself inside your mind. You know, your brain thinks that it's important if you say it often enough, so it's going to say that evidence and then look for more evidence that supports it. So that's why we need to change the conversations that we're having with ourselves.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:28:27

Absolutely. I was watching, I think this is relevant. Yesterday, I was watching an event with Matthew McConaughey, the art of loving the art of living.

Katie Miller: 00:28:39

I was watching that too.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:28:41

I think all of it that I saw, like the last half of it. And at the end, he was talking about being selfish. Yes. And how selfish and selfless is actually the same thing. Because when we take care of ourselves, it's it's just like the oxygen mask when we take care of ourselves, we can take better care of other people. And I think that was his whole point. But saying it in a unique, unique way. And I was really happy that I got to hear him talk about that.

Katie Miller: 00:29:14

Yeah, it wasn't so much amazing messaging in the event that he had, and the part about selfish and selfless and there were parts that were about the you know, having the conversation with yourself and realizing that it's okay. And the I don't know if you saw this part but towards the beginning he was sharing a story about where I don't even remember what the movie was, to be honest, but his first big blockbuster and he was talking about how in impostor syndrome came in. Because he was questioning whether or not he was worthy of this sudden boost in his, him being a celebrity. And he goes through the whole story about, you know, taking a break and going to some monastery to yo meditate and talk to the brothers there. And I'm trying to, I don't want to get the details wrong. So I'm not gonna, like try and share his story or anything. But he apparently he like, told everything, like everything to one of the monks. And when he was done, he was thinking, Oh, my gosh, I'm going to be judged, I'm going to be criticized, this person's going to tell me what I've done wrong. And the brother leaned over and whispered, me too. I mean, this is somebody who's hasn't been in Hollywood hasn't been in the movies or anything else, but still had the same kind of intrusive, negative thoughts about being an imposter. That it was not good enough. And I'm like, well, shoot, I'm gonna share the words me too, with everybody. Because guess what, you're not alone.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:31:19

It's so true. It's like the most trivial things that we tell ourselves. We think it's just us using it like, Yes, I'm the one who just does not want to get out of bed.

Katie Miller: 00:31:36

And that can be a big accomplishment on Sundays.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:31:38

Yes, it can.

Katie Miller: 00:31:40

I know that that could be accomplishment on Sundays.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:31:43

And like, logically understanding that there's probably millions of other people on that same morning, who feel exactly the same way. But we all think it's just us. And there's something wrong with us. And it's, it's not, we're just all flawed human beings trying to survive in this world. And, you know,

Katie Miller: 00:32:10

it's part of the caveman brain. And literally, because our brain was designed to always be on the lookout for danger. That's how the caveman survived as they were keeping constant vigilance on what plants were safe to eat, where it was safe to walk, you know, so they didn't run into something or walk through something. And were to stay away from the animals. So everything was always looked through this lens of caution. And if one person was ill, or sick, they were removed from the tribe, the community. So then that way, everyone else didn't get sick. Well, that kind of leaves us all with the same kind of brain mentality that we're afraid to get booted off the island. I mean, think about it. It's true. Yo, well, I don't know, there was a few episodes of survivor that I saw him, I'm like, yeah, if I was there, I wish I could boot it off, because I don't want to be around this drama. You know, you were like, Oh, we don't want our friends and family to know what's going on. Because we don't want them to think less of us. Well, one, if they think less of you, they're not really your friend. Most of them want to be there and will ask what can I do to help you?

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:33:40

And that people who really don't care or, or bully you or talk negative about it, or people that you should not have in your life? I'm sorry, but that's true.

Katie Miller: 00:33:52

And it's hard to walk away from somebody who's been in your life for a long period of time. But you have to realize that you've got to take care of yourself first. You put on that oxygen mask first, the airlines had it right for decades, and we never do it.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:34:10

It's true. It's true. But yeah, I think it's it's part of our hope course on our website that's free, kind of like your workbook. That is the P and hope is all about protecting your mind. And that WHO ARE YOU surrounding yourselves with? Be surrounding yourself with people who lift you up and support you? Or are you surrounding yourself with people who tear you down? And it goes back to what Katie said about what we tell ourselves, you know, if we're, if we're beating ourselves up, and then we have people around us who are agreeing with that and saying the same things. No wonder we don't want to get out of bed. You know, if there are people Even if you're having negative self talk to yourself, and you're surrounded with loving people who support you and lift you up, then it's easier to get out of that place.

Katie Miller: 00:35:12

And there is a trick for that, which is part of a workshop that I teach. So here's the micro version of that. When you notice you are having a negative thought your note normally notice because you're all of a sudden your energy level will drop. Yep. So if you start going to Well, that was stupid. Why did I do that? You know, change the way you're thinking, Phil. Oh, I used to believe I was stupid because I made this mistake. Now I've decided and then what's the opposite? So for me, my biggest struggle was I'm not good enough. I was last one picked for softball. Last one picked for this last one big for that. I'm not good enough. I don't get straight A's. I'm not good enough. Well, phooey on that. I used to believe stick it in the past where it belongs. I used to believe that I wasn't good enough. Now I've decided I am good enough. And I know this is true, because and then I list the evidence that shows that I am good enough. I am good enough to run a business. How do I know this? Because I have my own business. I am good enough to be a mom, how do I know this? Because I'm a mom. I am good enough to help others. Because that's what I do. And I can look back and be like, Oh, I remember when I was a teenager. And I did tons of community service on top of what was required for me to graduate. That shows that I'm good at helping people. I know that I'm good enough, because I got straight A's. My senior year, but unheard of in my world. That was pretty cool.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:37:08

That's great. No, I think it's, it's that manifestation which I always thought was just, you know, it's kind of like people were told me to journal, people that told me to do meditation. And I'd be like, I don't have time for any of that. And, you know, thankfully, I had a lot of time in 2020, to process all of this stuff. And do some of those things that I always put off because I was too busy. And learned how valuable it is. And I was listening to Mel Robbins yesterday. And she was talking about you know how when she first was when she first did her TED talk, and or one of them. And hers, her first speaking gig and how totally nervous she was. And she had never done it before. And she was like, I don't know if she tells the story way better than me. But I was like

Katie Miller: 00:38:12

me trying to say Matthew McConaughey. Sorry, not good.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:38:15

And her her point, though, was that every day she got up saying, I'm going to accomplish this, I'm gonna accomplish. I'm going it was no. I mean, she was doubting it. She was nervous. She was scared, but she's like, instead of telling myself all those things, I'm going to tell myself what is going to happen. And, you know, sometimes that takes a while to materialize. But it is the mindset that we need to have in order to rise above the mental health issues and the the self doubt issues and the, you know, self deprecation issues. How do we get above that it is really about just believing. And Napoleon Hill his famous quote about, you know, whatever the mind can believe and conceive, you can achieve. Right? And that has stuck with me for years. Because I used to think of it more in a business sense and like business goals and stuff like that. And now I really think more about it personally. And it's really powerful.

Katie Miller: 00:39:35

It is and that's one of the reasons why I use the tool where I list the evidence to support my new empowering decision that I am good enough. It's the same thing as like we shouting Oh, if because I haven't seen a unicorn yet. You know, it's putting that file of evidence and organizing it inside our brain. So then that way next time the negative thought comes up. Here's all this evidence to show me that negative thought As Ron, you know, when we do the journaling, and we're just writing about everything that's going on in our lives, we can go back and look at it and be like, Oh, look what I used to believe. I really used to think about that of myself, Oh, so much better I evidence that's gone. And then get rid of it. You know, I've been doing this for a couple years. So pretty much the limiting beliefs come and go. But they don't stick. Yeah. Because of the fact that I've now got this file folder of evidence for these limiting beliefs. My hardest limiting belief, this was the hardest one for me to conquer. Because I could not make money as an entrepreneur. And that was a limiting belief that I adopted back when I was a teenager, and my mom was a stay at home daycare provider. And I can remember the money arguments between her and my stepfather. And I was like, That's it, I have to have a nine to five job, I have to know what my paycheck is every two weeks. So then that way I can budget take care of my bills, take care of my family, that's that. So I have always had a, I call it nine to five, even though sometimes I was working graveyard shifts. You know, I always had a W two job. Well, then COVID hit and I lost my w two job. And nobody was hiring because everything was shutting down. So what option that I have, do absolutely nothing. Or find a way to move forward with the mission and me helping get the message out and study to be a coach so that I can help people. And I still struggled with I can't make money as an entrepreneur, I can't make money as an entrepreneur. But then I did this flip and started listening evidence. And I was like, Well, I hadn't missed a mortgage payment. I had enough money to pay my groceries. Wow, I made more money this one month than I did in my corporate job. I can make money as an entrepreneur. And here's the evidence that shows that I could pull my crap. Okay, I need to raise the dollar amount of how much money I can make?

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:42:31

No, that's awesome. That's awesome. Thank you so much for having this conversation with me today. I'm super excited about people reading your chapter. And people going to your website, I'll put it up one more time to see the resources you have for teens and parents, but also anyone who anyone is experiencing mental health issues or suicidal ideation. So go check out Katie's website,

Katie Miller: 00:43:04

even if you're not dealing with suicidal thoughts, and you're just dealing with ugly, icky negative thoughts. Use the tools, you'll build yourself a buffer between yourself and alleged that you don't even know is there.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:43:18

Yeah, that's awesome.

Katie Miller: 00:43:20

And it's free.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:43:22

It's great time. So I want to also tell you about our website, which is the realized foundation.org. And you can find all about our books there, you can fill out an application there if you're interested in telling your story. You can also read about our events, and other things we're doing. And we have some free videos. We have a whole YouTube channel of interviews and conversations if you're interested in that. And you can follow us on social media, you can join our scars to stars alive Facebook group, or we maybe we'll see you at one of our events. So thank you so much for listening. And it was an interesting conversation. We kind of went all over the board.

Katie Miller: 00:44:08

Yes, we did. You know what? That's okay, because we can't do this wrong.

Deana Brown Mitchell: 00:44:15

It's just about the conversations and you never know what sentence is going to catch someone's attention. Like, I haven't seen a unicorn yet. So we hope things will happen. We hope that you're we hope to see you somewhere soon. And I hope you have a fabulous day.

Katie Miller: 00:44:36

I hope you do too, sweetie. And thank you so much for what you're doing with the book and the resources that you share.